- R-54-2013 - Severing relations with Downe Township Emergency Mecial Services, Inc.
- R-55-2013 - Rescinding resolution R-08-2013 and designating a first responder for Downe Township for emergency medical services for the remainder of 2013. (R-08-2013 designated Downe Township Emergency Medical Services, Inc. as the primary care provider for emergency medical service calls within Downe Township)
- R-56-2013 - Approval to seek cooperation with Downe Township Emergency Medical Services, Inc. and the USDA for purposes of seeking a novation of a loan on the 2007 ambulance owned by Downe Township Emergency Medical Services, Inc.
The residents need to be heard!!! This is an assumption of mine, but I assume the "first responder" that the township designates will NOT come cheap. My bet would be the cost is greater than the $5,000 the township allotted DTEMS.
The final resolution listed above (R-56-2013) basically says the township wants the cooperation of DTEMS and the USDA in transferring the terms of the loan to another entity.
Anyone planning to attending this meeting...bring a Snickers. It looks like it may be a LONG night!
So the township wants to hire someone that may come in and bill the residents for the services that they were getting without extra cost other than their taxes that went to the squad which was only 5000.00 a year cut from 10000.00 a year. So I guess we pay the company and hope we don't need them!??!!! Because I know what it costs from a company that bills to get a ride in an ambulance ...do they?? Hell they can't even get the numbers right for squad 36 so I'm sure they have no idea....
ReplyDeleteGiven the fact the large portion of residents are senior citizens, on a fixed budget, this new emergency services provider could create quite a hardship for the largest group of residents, and the group that is most likely to need the service. Wonder if this is something that was/will be taken toon account when severing ties with DTEMS.
DeleteI've heard a few committee members don't actually live within the township and the mayor doesn't pay his bills...so I guess they could care less.
DeleteThey can say they are going to pay Cedarville and they are volunteer BUT I have heard they are planning on billing soon also. Watch out township of downe. You are going to get screwed! Anyone else is already paid squads and charge.
DeleteMost squads bill now either career or volunteer. It is just a sign of the times. Unfortunately it sounds that most do not understand how the billing can be set up. I work for a department that bills and it only charges township residents insurance. If you do not have insurance you do not get a bill or taken to collections or anything of the sort. What people fail to understand is that those terms are all negotiable and can be set up in a way that works best for our township. Out of township residents get a full bill for use of ther services. The billing is a great way to supplement the ems budget especially since it appears to be a meager budget as is, if DTEMS is kept open i believe that they should persue the billing option to help with costs and also generate money for the township. I live in Downe Twp and this is my opinion.
ReplyDeleteYour points are all valid. However, if a paid company takes over the contract will be negotiated one of two ways. First, the township pays $xxxxx and that company won't balance bill (whatever the insurance company doesn't pay) the patient. Or, the township doesn't pay $xxxxx and the company bills the patient for the balance of the transport, after the insurance company has paid their portion. Now, if the township is going to pay $xxxxx, why not supply the local squad with what they are already giving them, a small meager budget, and there is no extra financial burden on the tax payers??? Unfortunately, my opinion is the call volume isn't high enough for ANY paid company to say we will only bill the patients insurance. The paid company will more then likely want $xxxxx yearly.
DeleteNo one knows what the township committee will do, but either way it seems to be a waste of tax payer money since there are volunteers that are willing to do this for $5000/year. And just for those that don't know, the $5000 is the operating budget for the squad. The members of the squad do NOT benefit financially from providing this service to the residents.
If you bill don't you have to have two EMTS on the truck? If this is true billing wouldn't be an option for Squad 36. Right now Downe runs with an EMT & a driver that is CRP certified if that's all they have show up for the call
DeleteBUT Anonymous... U "heard" that about LTEMS... Really... Do u know it to BE fact??? Probably NOT... So that makes u just as wrong as the downe twp committee right??? U are publicly stating an untrue fact... Because it was something u "heard"... Tisk tisk
ReplyDeleteI also heard they were going paid and were going to start yo bill. And that's why they pushed for this, so they could add 200 calls that they could bill to help make it possible. I heard it from a reliable source high up in the leadership of LTEMS. So I believe the other poster!
DeleteHow does stating something you heard and telling everyone that you are unsure if it is true the same as putting something out there as a truth?
ReplyDeleteWHERE in your statement did u say that u are unsure???? and I quote "BUT I have heard they are planning on billing soon also" end quote!! Nowhere did u say u are unsure if what u "HEARD" was untrue!!! So again I say..why is it OK that u write or say something that isnt FACT just "heard"... and then people in the public can read that and assume something about that organization that in fact is NOT truth.....
ReplyDeleteIf you "heard" something does that automatically make it true? I would assume that if something was "heard" it could be a possibility. Therefore, it is possible LTEMS could begin to bill for their services.
DeleteHow is something you HEAR a fact. If you state it as just that. Something you heard That's all it is. Something you heard. The township committee was given the actual numbers and commented on the news with totally different unsupported numbers that were nowhere even close to the true factual numbers.
ReplyDeleteYeah it would require the rig to be state certified and you would need two emts on the rig to respond by state standard. In my opinion that would show that the squad is taking a step in the right direction to help move the issues brought forward and show that they have a plan to improve the service provided. After all that is what this is all about the "service" to the community. Anyone can pull statistics and twist them to use them in a manner in which suits their cause. For example the letter that I received yesterday from Squad 36 stated that since the beginning of the year the squad has responded to 91.11% of all calls for service in the township which sounds great but the fact is there is currently no "time" constraints in that response because there are no rules that require that a volunteer squad arrive on location in a timely manner. The fact is that it doesn't matter if you were able to respond the ambulance in 30 seconds or 30 minutes as long as the ambulance signs on responding to the call at some point during the emergency then the call is considered answered. Now I am not stating that the squad has ever taken 30 minutes to respond to a call because I do not believe that to be true but I am just pointing out that as a tax paying resident, and I think that I speak for most normal none emergency responder residents, when I say that it doesn't really matter what the name on the side of the ambulance, fire truck, or police car says as long as when I call 911 for what ever type of emergency I have that the appropriate people show up in a timely manner and with quality trained people to handle whatever the emergency is that I am currently experiencing. I believe that is a reasonable request for the money that I pay in taxes and the duty that the township "owes" the residents.
ReplyDeleteThere are rules to how long it takes for any particular squad to respond to a call. After the initial dispatch, the squad has I believe 3 minutes to respond before a 2nd dispatch. If there is no response in 2 or 3 minutes (I don't remember which) a 3rd dispatch is sent out along with a dispatch for mutual aid. If the squad initially dispatched does respond at this time, this dispatch is considered the 1st dispatch for mutual aid. After that the process starts over if the mutual aid does not respond within their allotted time frame. It is possible for this process to go through several squads before there is an answer to the call, however it is a rather rare occasion when that happens. Once a squad responds to a call, there is of course travel time from the squad building to the actual call. Unless you live across the street from the squad building, you could be looking at a several minutes depending where the ambulance is coming from.
DeleteI've HEARD a lot of things in my lifetime like Mayor Campbell is a wonderful caring person who's only interested in what's best for the township and Jesus Christ walked on water and turned water into wine. Now I have NO concrete proof that either of those things are true BUT one of them is much easier (for some) to believe than the other.
ReplyDeleteThe fact is, that none of us know what the Committee is going to do or why they are doing it. I do believe (no concrete evidence) that no matter what the Mayor says, this entire ordeal is coming from the Mayor's hidden personal agenda/vendetta. whether it's true or false it doesn't matter at this point because it's happening regardless the reason. We will all know the outcome May 6th. Would we like to know the real reason behind this action? Yes! Will we? No. So moving on...
As I see it, there are 4 possible outcomes here:
1-Putting a outside "Paid" service in place. Personally I don't think this is a viable option due to the cost of service vs. call volume.
2-Putting in a "Part-time Paid" service. Many other volunteer squads have or are going to this option to cover the daytime calls because their members, like most people, work during the day. This option, however, leaves in question, who is the volunteer service that will handle the night time calls? Which leads to option #3.
3-Share services. Again, this is an option that many municipalities are doing for jobs that don't need to be full time. It makes better financial sense to share the cost. But there normally is a cost. IF Lawrence Twp. were to share services, they would need some kind of monetary compensation for the use of their equipment. The DTEMS operating budget of $5000 a year is probably not enough (my opinion). $5000 PLUS the DTEMS ambulance might work. (That's another fly in the ointment to be discussed) Or I suppose the Committee could pull money from the Fire Budgets if need be.
4-Hand over the EMS duties to one of the 3 (or is that 2?) Fire Districts in the Township. Again, another viable option providing of course the DTEMS ambulance is part of that deal. Of course Fortescue is the only district that this would work for. They already have 1st Responders. Their relationship with DTEMS has not been good for years so it would play into the Mayors agenda of a personal vendetta, that is of course IF he has one, and would be a double slap in the face to all the DTEMS members.
Continued:
DeleteNow I've mentioned the inclusion of the DTEMS ambulance in 3 of these scenario. his is where it get tricky.
The Township could not apply for the USDA Grant that bought the ambulance, because either the grant was for Non-profits or because the Township is well a Township and not eligible for government grants. Either way, DTEM became, with the Townships blessing, a separate, non-profit entity, becoming eligible for the USDA Grant. The Township agreed to make the monthly payments on the grant and continue to supply DTEMS with an operating budget. The USDA holds the title to the ambulance and will turn it over to DTEMS once the grant is repaid. Just like any financial institution, they don't care who actually supplies the money to make the monthly payments as long as they get paid. So this arrangement worked out nicely for all concerned.
So here's a question...If a parent, agrees to make the monthly payments on a car for their child, knowing that the child is or will be the title holder, and then the parent decides that the child should no longer be allowed to drive the car that they are paying for, who actually owns the car? The child, who is or will be the title holder, or the parent who is paying for it?
The Township Committees seems to think that DTEMS will work with them to transfer the grant for the ambulance to the township. Don't forget that the township couldn't get the grant in the first place so transferring it to them is probably NOT going to happen. Could that grant be transferred to Lawrence Twp EMS or Fortescue Fire? Possibly. Could DTEMS sell the ambulance outright for the remainder on the grant? More than likely since the USDA has already said they would help them sell it. Could DTEMS sell it to the Township? Certainly. Will they? Now there's a question!
Looking at it from DTEMS point of view, my initial reaction would be "Screw you Mr. Mayor, I'm not going to make this easy for you!". But with that response, DTEMS would be creating a hardship for the taxpayers if ANY of the above scenarios were true. Not to mention they would be lowering themselves to the same level of vengeful tantrum throwing as the Mayor has been accused of (that is if this is personal on the Mayor's part).
What to do, what to do?
To sum up my rather long ramblings, personal feeling MUST be put aside for the benefit of the people both organizations are committed to serve! A 3rd disinterested party should be brought in to mediate this mess before it gets any uglier than it already is. Someone needs to get their big boy panties out of bunch, pull them up and be the the person they were elected to be. The only ones that will be hurt in the long run are the residence that pay the taxes here.
The above are my opinions and are NOT intended to be interpreted as FACT!
Couple minor corrections to the last two posts (1). There are currently only two fire districts in Downe Twp. Fortescue and Newport Fire departments merged about 5 years ago and the districts were merged into one district. This was voted on by the citizens of downe twp and passed. With the merger of the fire departments it created Downe Twp. Fire & Rescue Company #1. The other district is in Dividing Creek. The other thing is by the virtue of the fire departments both Downe Twp Fire & Rescue and also Dividing Creek being fire districts with separate elections and laws that dictate the use of the funds the township committee could not just move money from either district to the squad or any other interest. The way the districts work is that there is an election of commissioners and a vote for the budget and then the money is spent and appropriated for the departments by the commissioners of those districts. Even though the money for the districts is collected by the Township and then distributed to the districts the only way for the township to have actual control of the money would be for a referendum be placed on a ballot to disband the fire districts all together. But while were are on the subject of fire districts why is there a need for 2 fire districts with separate budgets and commissioners in a township that is as small as ours?
ReplyDeleteThank you for clarify the Fire District budget issue. I knew Newport and Fortescue had merged but was not sure how that effected their budgets or even how their budgets worked. I'm sure neither district would not be happy if their budgets were cut in half as DTEMS's was. As far as why there are more than 1 fire district even though it is a small township population wise, the answer may be because of the size area wise. It made sense for Fortescue & Newport to merge due to their relative locations. Dividing Creek, not so much. And there is the issue of everyone playing nicely in the sandbox together. Could be why Lawrence Twp Fire is mutual aid for Fortescue and not Dividing Creek...but I digress. The number of Fire Districts is a good question, but one for another time.
DeleteThe Twp. com. was given paper work 2yrs. ago to start a paid part time ems. during the hrs, of 6-6,the twp. never pursued the issue and that was the end.The whole thing is a personal vendetta the Mayor has with one of the members, when he told them one thing and did nothing about what he said. When he was approached about it he stated that the solicitor didn't recommend doing what the mayor said he would do.But the mayor couldn't even pick the phone up and call the member. and in Feb. they pass a resolution for dtems for ems coverage for 2013, and in April they close the doors. sounds like they should do homework first and correct it later.and before closing the whole thing in the nut shell is the way it is being done, good ole boy back door politics because the mayor got his feelings hurt, his hiney puckered up,and the member is a good citizen in the twp. with no "skeletons" in their closet,
ReplyDeleteI believe the Twp. had a meeting with the squad last Aug. about the same issue, after the meeting the Twp. said "we will meet with the first responders and see why they won't help out when needed" when the mayor was asked about the meeting and how it went, Quote we didn't have it the ambulance is getting out everything is ok.So the committee seems to not care.
ReplyDeleteOr the mayor knew that his plan was to close the squad so why take his time to blow more smoke up their asses. He had no intention of fixing anything that may have been wrong. He is taking his personal problems with a member on the whole squad and township.
DeleteFACT! I am Kevin Scarlato, Chief of Lawrence Township Emergency Medical Service.
ReplyDeleteFACT! Over a year and a half ago we talked about a partial paid service and it has not went any further than that.
FACT! LTEMS has not and did not push for this to happen. Our squad is very happy running 360+ calls a year for service.
FACT! I am the person who spoke to Mark Upham Jr., DTEMS Chief, when this first happened on April 1. He had no clue until I called and spoke to him about it.
FACT! The members of LTEMS are paying a debt back to Downe Twp. for service from 1992 when we closed Cedarville Rescue to form LTEMS.
FACT! On April 4, I told a Downe Twp. Committee member that we would cover Downe Twp for 2 months, concluding on June 6. No other mention of time has been brought before myself or other members of LTEMS.
FACT! I am available 24/7/365 if anyone (Anonymous also) would like to speak to me.
These are the facts from LTEMS.